Fuente : U.S. Department of State
http://www.state.gov/

POWELL: Interview on Fox's Hannity & Colmes

/noticias.info/ Secretary Colin L. Powell
Washington, DC
January 11, 2005
(12:50 p.m. EDT)

MR. HANNITY: Joining us now, Secretary of State Colin Powell. Mr. Secretary, it's always good to see you. You just toured the region where the tsunami disaster was. Tell us what you saw.

SECRETARY POWELL: I have never seen anything like it before, Sean -- let me start with that comment -- especially in Banda Aceh in Indonesia. It is as if a little nuclear weapon went off and just simply leveled half of a town, scraped clean houses, mosques, schools, bridges, cars, boats, vegetation. Everything just gone. But most importantly, people gone. Washed out of their homes, taken out to sea, drowned and then put back up on the beach. A terrible scene of devastation. Not as bad in Sri Lanka or in Phuket, Thailand, but nevertheless throughout that part of the world this really is a tragedy and over 150,000 people lost their lives.

MR. HANNITY: It's very disturbing. The images are disturbing. The fact that early on people tried to politicize this -- I was very glad to see you were out there and you put an end to that very quickly. You made personally the first call the day that this happened and offered whatever assistance would be necessary. So explain the process for people that perhaps are under some illusion that we didn't react quickly enough with enough.

SECRETARY POWELL: Well, on Sunday morning, when I got word that this had happened, our task forces had already started to operate here in the State Department, as well as the U.S. Agency for International Development. So we were following it immediately.

And by Sunday afternoon, when it became clear that this is something very significant, I got on the telephone and called all of the affected countries through their foreign ministers, and I reached them all either Sunday night or Monday morning, recognizing there's a 12-hour time difference. What I said to each and every one of them, we're sorry about what happened, extend condolences, don't know how serious this is, but let us know what you need. Our ambassadors have already given money to your people. Let me know what you need, let our ambassadors know, and we're going to respond.

All of them said thanks very much, casualties look like they're in the hundreds or maybe a thousand or two. But by Monday, we could see it was growing so we gave $4 million in response to a $7 million request for assistance from the International Federation of the Red Cross. So we took up over 50 percent of what was asked for initially, and then we threw another 10 million, and then we threw another 15 million, a total of 15 million, and then another 20 million.

And we said all along that we would add whatever funds were necessary, we weren't capping our contribution. Nevertheless, people started characterizing that as stingy. And the fact of the matter is it was not. We were there first. And even though people have been using this as a source of controversy, the nations in the region -- I can tell you this because I've been there -- are enormously grateful for our willingness to step forward and, frankly, lead the effort, the international effort, until the international community caught up.

So people might comment about it here at home, but 70 percent of the American people, in accordance with a recent Gallup poll, think that we have done the right thing and we've done enough, and every country I spoke to are very happy that America stood tall and are helping them in this time of need.

MR. HANNITY: You characterized it as an investment, Mr. Secretary, in national security. And I thought about it in terms of the Muslim world and in the context that perhaps there will be a lot of goodwill that comes towards the United States in this way. But it makes me wonder, on the other hand, the number one murderer of Muslims in the world was Saddam Hussein, we removed him from power, and yet we didn't get credit on that front. Why would you be optimistic on this front?

SECRETARY POWELL: This is a slightly different case. Muslims were in need. They needed food. They needed water. They needed health care. And there were American sailors flying in in helicopters, and they weren't pointing guns at anybody, they weren't shooting anybody. They were reaching out and helping people. And that's an entirely different image.

And what I said in all of my interviews over the last ten days is we are doing this not because they're Muslims, but because they're humans and because we're Americans, and Americans are a compassionate people and we reach out. In this case, we're reaching out to Muslims. We've helped Muslims in a number of ways over the last 10 or 15 years, whether it was liberating Kuwait after they were invaded by a Muslim nation, Saddam Hussein's Iraq, in 1990, or Muslims in Kosovo who were being persecuted, or Muslims in Afghanistan who were being dominated by the terrorists led by Usama bin Laden and with the help of the Taliban.

The United States rescued all of these people. We don't get credit for it. It's a burden that we bear. We just have to keep working. Ultimately, when people see that Afghanistan is becoming a democracy and they have an elected government that they elected, that was not put in place by a terrorist organization, and when they see the same thing happen in Iraq, I think these attitudes will change.

MR. HANNITY: Mr. Secretary, the President has invited the new Palestinian President, Abbas, to the White House, something he did not extend that similar invitation to Yasser Arafat. And my question is: Do you think there's a newfound optimism by the Administration as it relates to the peace process, and how concerned should we be about Abbas' association with some of the terror groups, more specifically, during the election?

SECRETARY POWELL: We know Mr. Abbas very well. We got to know him very well last year when he was Prime Minister. And President Bush stood up alongside of him in the region and blessed the roadmap with him and when Prime Minister -- with Prime Minister Sharon of Israel. So we know him well.

Now, he did not achieve success as a prime minister then because Arafat was in the way. Arafat is gone. Mr. Abbas put himself before the Palestinian people and now he is their new President. Yes, he said some things during the campaign that were of concern to me, that were disturbing to me, and we'll raise them directly with Mr. Abbas.

But the campaign is now over and things get said in the height of a campaign as one is trying to garner support. But I believe he understands that he has to now take a strong position -- an open, vocal, clear position -- against terrorism. But more than just take a position. He has to fight against those forces within the Palestinian community that still thinks there is a role for terrorism. And if he does that, then the United States will be able to support him and he'll find that Israel can be a partner for peace with him as well.

I'm pleased that he and Prime Minister Sharon are already in touch with each other and are planning to meet in the near future.

MR. HANNITY: Moving on to the pending elections in Iraq, Mr. Secretary, Brent Scowcroft, who you worked with in the first Bush Administration, had a very pessimistic piece in the Los Angeles Times, as I'm sure you're aware, and he said he feared that the election would further alienate Iraq's Sunni Muslim population, it had a great potential for deepening the conflict, and talked about that this could be the beginning of a civil war at the present time.

Your reaction to his comments?

SECRETARY POWELL: Well, first, I have great respect for my dear friend and colleague, Brent Scowcroft. But regardless of his point of view, we have to go forward and have this election. The Iraqi people deserve to be heard and let them decide how they wish to be governed.

I don't believe it will necessarily result in the kind of outcome that Mr. Scowcroft reflected upon and was musing about. I think that it could just as easily be the case, and I'm confident will be the case, that with this kind of positive result, the people of Iraq selecting their own leaders, that gives new energy to the people of Iraq to help them put down this insurgency along with the military forces of the coalition and Iraq's own armed forces.

So I think we have to have this election, and the election could be a catalyzing event to bring the Iraqi people to the realization that the enemies of Iraq are not the coalition forces that are helping; the enemy of Iraq are these terrorists and former regime elements. And so I hope that will be the outcome, and not the outcome that Mr. Scowcroft was reflecting about.

MR. HANNITY: And how important is it for Sunni participation in the election and how important is it for Sunni participation in the government, assuming that, being a minority, they won't be the winners?

SECRETARY POWELL: They will be a minority. The Shia are the majority of the population, a majority that was oppressed for so many years by Saddam Hussein. But I think it's important that there is a good Sunni turnout. I don't know what the number is going to be, but we're encouraging Sunnis to come forward. And they want to come forward. The reason that there may be not as many coming forward as we hope is because of the insurgency, so we've got to do everything we can to improve security.

But I hope there will be a good Sunni turnout, and there must be Sunni representation in the government or the government would not be reflective of the entire population of Iraq and therefore it would have trouble moving forward.

MR. HANNITY: I know, Mr. Secretary, I speak for a lot of Americans inasmuch as I have lost a lot of confidence in the United Nations, and particularly the Oil-for-Food scandal. Are you satisfied the investigation is being handled properly and do you still have confidence, and to what degree if you do, in Kofi Annan as a leader there?

SECRETARY POWELL: Well, first of all, I have a lot of confidence in Paul Volcker. I, frankly, participated in pushing him forward as a candidate for this investigation. He's a man of great skill and competence and credibility. So I'd like to wait and see for his completed work on this matter.

But what we've heard so far is that there were serious problems inside the UN on the management of this. We're not sure if there were criminal problems, but there were certainly serious management problems, and the Secretary General will have to be accountable for those management problems.

But I think Kofi Annan is a very distinguished gentleman. He has served the cause of humanity well over the years. I work very closely with him and I'm going to continue to work closely with him, as long as he is the Secretary General.

The responsibility does not rest entirely on Kofi Annan. It also rests on the membership, and especially on the Security Council, and we are a member of the Security Council. It was the Security Council that had the responsibility for the day-to-day management of this program.

So I want to wait and see the results of the Volcker investigation, as well as the investigations that are being done by the United States Congress, before we make any judgments about the overall management of this by the United Nations or how it might affect Kofi Annan.

MR. HANNITY: All right. Now on a more personal note, you have often told me that you serve at the pleasure of the President. You've decided you're not going to stay for a second term. And I was watching you, Mr. Secretary, with the President yesterday and it appears to me that you have a great fondness for him, that you guys had a great working relationship together, in spite of perhaps some intramural squabbles you may have had with Defense or elsewhere.

But your relationship with the President, how would you describe it? What would you tell the American people about your relationship, and more importantly, what's next? What's the next chapter in Colin Powell's future?

SECRETARY POWELL: Let me answer the second part first. I don't know. I have been getting some very interesting business offers. I expect I'll go back and make some speeches and do some other things that will keep me somewhat in the public eye, but I haven't settled on a full agenda of activity yet.

With respect to my relationship with the President, it's a good relationship. It's been very strong all along. And the President, I think, appreciated the fact that I would always tell him what I thought, I would give him the benefit of my experience. And sometimes it was in agreement with all of my colleagues, and that was more often than not, and sometimes it was not. But that's what I'm supposed to do. I'm not paid to be in consensus. I'm paid to give my best judgment. And that's what I always did and I think the President always appreciated that.

And, frankly, when I look at what we've accomplished over the last four years, whether it has to do with doubling the amount of development assistance we're giving to the world, what we're doing with HIV/AIDS, the Sudan peace agreement that I witnessed the other day in Nairobi, the disarming of Libya, the way we brought attention on nuclear proliferation in Iran and Iraq, the free trade agreements we have entered into, the good relationship we have with China and with Russia, the progress we're now making in the Middle East, I'm pretty comfortable with the record of this Administration in the first four years in foreign policy and I'm pleased to have been able to play a role in that record.

And I think it's a role I play because of the very strong relationship, both professional and personal relationship, that I have with President Bush. I've known him and members of the family for a long time, and sometimes I think I'm a part of that family and I think I always will be.

MR. HANNITY: Well, Mr. Secretary, you can put all diplomacy aside and maybe you can fill in for me here and join that vigorous debate. But anyway, Mr. Secretary, you have accomplished a lot. It's always been good to have the pleasure of you being on the show. Thank you for being with us. We hope to talk a lot in the future, and thanks for all you do. Thank you.

SECRETARY POWELL: Thanks very much, Sean.

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